Season 4 Episode 12: Patty

[enemyofperfect]

We're so close to the end of the series, and I'm not ready, but I'm also really looking forward to tonight's episode! Whenever you get a chance to watch it, please share all your episode reactions with us in the comments right here. Spoilers and speculation welcome!

Comments

[erinptah]

I'm watching the latest episodes on the NBC website -- might be an option in your region too? There's ads, but it's free.

It's not quite as straightforward as "oblivion" -- I rewatched that scene, and transcribed the whole explanation:


Chidi: "We're gonna set up a new kind of door. Somewhere peaceful. So that, when you feel happy and satisfied and complete, and you want to leave The Good Place for good, you can just walk through it, and your time in the universe will end."

Tahani: "You don't *have* to go through it if you don't want to. But you *can*. And hopefully, knowing that you don't have to be here forever will help you feel happier while you are."

Audience guy: "What will happen when we go through it?"

Janet: "Well, we don't really know, exactly. All we know is, it will be peaceful, and your journey will be over."

Michael: [Do everything you want while you're here,] "...and when you're ready, walk through one last door, and be at peace. Does that sound good?"

[Audience cheers.]


So, since "it's outside this sphere of existence, and we don't know the specifics, but it'll be peaceful and your journey will be over" is already a common Earth-based description of Heaven...what they've really done is create meta-Heaven.

Which IMO only raises more questions. If Janet is *making* this door, why doesn't she know what's on the other side, and how are they so sure it'll be nice? If their goal is to recreate a set of circumstances on Earth, why wouldn't behind-the-door just recreate the circumstances of the Good Place, with the same fundamental problem? And if the problem really is solved behind-the-door, why couldn't they just put that solution into action on *this* side of the door?

...I feel like I've been on a regular cycle of "this feels unsatisfying, but let's wait for the next episode, maybe they'll make it better" this season. With only 2 episodes left, I'm still curious and definitely gonna watch, but I'm not setting my expectations too high, you know?

[thatwasjustadream]

Ah, thanks for the tip on the web site- I tried every mobile and streaming option last night but failed to try the web site, lol.

Well, I have to say I neither loved nor hated the epi - which is how I've felt about it all season. I think looking back at it from some future point the most pivotal, impactful moment for me will have been the end of S3. It made me cry my eyes out, something few stories do. And that 'what's it all about' convo between a grieving Eleanor and Janet rang so raw and true. Gah. *That* was amazing story telling.

Anyway - I guess I'm not surprised they touched on both oblivion and the concept of immortality being a recipe for horrible ennui. The later is such a huge trope, it almost had to get a nod.

There are other potential fixes that jump right to mind: Give the people who need windmills to tilt at some windmills interspersed with stretches of peace; Give the luxury and sensations seekers endless milkshakes and orgasms; give the purpose-driven humans to tend to. Angelic duties.

Or, you know, just make it so a human sense of time passing isn't a thing once you aren't human anymore. But if they solved it last night, we wouldn't get two more half hours next week.

Maybe all shows feel like they're barreling down some weird, bumpy road in the final season - a trend I've noticed with
a lot of my faves. Endings are hard, and few stick the landing.

They could have simply said that the Final Door leads to becoming one with the universe- part of the fabric, but not a conscious part. I think they didn't go there because we'll see the characters all departing at their chosen times this week - I fear they may go heartstrings with it, which I am not sure wouldn't be awful. I hope they go as wild and inventive as that Season Two premiere - i.e. go out with some *fun* please!

[erinptah]

They could have simply said that the Final Door leads to becoming one with the universe- part of the fabric, but not a conscious part.

Yeah, this is how they fix death in His Dark Materials, and it's really fulfilling and believably hopeful. The worldbuilding that led up to it was different, so it wouldn't work the same with The Good Place, but it could've been satisfying in its own way! Definitely more so than Magical Oblivion Mystery Door.

Same re: the heartstrings ending :/

I've been keeping up with the podcast, which has people from all different parts of the show's creation talk about behind-the-scenes stuff, and any time there's a heartstrings-tugging scene they'll talk about how much people cried at the table read.

On the one hand: having writers who care is better than the alternative! On the other: it sometimes feels like their approach is "we're all completely on-board with this thing, so let's just indulge and roll around in it for a while" -- and they stop doing the work to bring the audience on board. So if you aren't there already (even if you're pretty close, and could've been brought the rest of the way with a few more scenes of work), it'll just leave you cold. And that would be a rough way to close the whole thing out.

[thatwasjustadream]

I'm going to have to read His Dark Materials. I think of it as YA, which isn't my first choice to read, but I take it that's not entirely the case? I keep bumping into references to it so maybe it's time to get it read!

Agreed on that last point. I hate to knock the show too much - it'll likely always stand out as a top ten favorite of mine, ever - but like a lot of franchises, I probably won't look forward to re-watching the last season.

There's still hope for the finale being a fun ride. :}

[erinptah]

HDM is more like Harry Potter or The Hobbit, in the sense that it's kid-friendly but loooong. It doesn't have any of what I think of as the stock tropes of YA -- there's no love triangles, there are complex and active/competent characters of all ages, the worldbuilding is extremely dense.

(Our first POV character is already familiar with a lot of it, too -- I was seriously confused when I read the first book as a kid, because there are so many weird concepts and alternate-universe terms that it doesn't stop to explain. Definitely a series that benefits from rereading, at any age!)

It's not a comedy like TGP, but if you want another series that sets up a cosmology for how souls/the afterlife/religion works and then explores the fallout, it's well worth checking out.

...also, I bet Lyra and Eleanor would get along swimmingly.

[enemyofperfect]

I'm so glad you were able to watch the episode! Despite everyone's lukewarm feelings about the way this season is wrapping up...

Your thoughts about possible fixes are great. Especially after our main cast found such meaning in helping each other, it's strange to have that element lacking here. (Unless they're planning to bring that out in the finale?)

I hope they go as wild and inventive as that Season Two premiere - i.e. go out with some *fun* please!

Yes, please!